Wouldn’t touch Nikasil on an air cooled with a ten foot pole…!!!!

Ask around, there are tons of folks who got hosed on very expensive builds…

I prefer the Indian Bomber over the Dark Horse. Green is my favorite colour and I tend more toward grey than black. Matte paint is easier to care for, that is a plus. Also my dad was in WW2 and he bought a ‘47 Chief after he got home. Although this was way before my time I heard several stories of him and my mom riding this bike. Wish he kept it for me…oh well..

Michael:I may give you a call at some point, thanks again.

R.Alan

However, back to my main issue & that is the price. The cheapest Chief is $27,000 plus. If in St. Paul, all you have to do is go across the parking lot & you are at the St. Paul HD. No matter what you want to say, the Chief Roadmaster & Vintage look alot more like a Heritage Softail then they do even the Electra Glide Standard. They have leather bags & what looks like a detachable windshield. They list for $34,000.

The Electra Glide Standard has hard bags & a fairing. They go for $17,000. The fairing gives you the option to add a stereo. Half the price for what would seem to be a bit more bike.

I am not a touring bike guy, so bags & windshields do little for me.

Just when you put the 2 next to each other & one is twice the price & the only thing they can tell you is you will be treated like a king by Indian & not like one of the faceless HD, well yeah for $34,000 I’d hope for good treatment. They also said the lower number of bikes being made & sold will have it keeps it’s value, as they only wanted to sell 700 this year.

The owner was also telling me Indian would like a dealer in every state, but they guaranteed him he’d be the only Indian dealer for three years in the Minnesota, Wisconsin & Illinois markets. A buyer could go to Michigan for a bike though.

I wanted to ask him, did you get a guarantee Indian would be around in 3, 4 or even 10 years this time round?

Like I said, beautiful bike & I really like this Dark Horse. Just might have to wait for them to hit Ebay before I think about buying one. Scouts & Spirits from the last time don’t go for more then $8,000 now.

Back to the 09……………the primary is vastly different with regards to width and has less oil capacity. You have to look at the two side by side to see the differences. The good news is that the new primary is also interchangeable with the Gilroy bikes. The inner primary on the Gilroy did have what I call design issues. Not good or bad but you cannot remove the stator without removing the inner primary. What a hassle! The new 09 primary still has this issue. Early Harley suffered from these same design issues but later addressed it and re-designed their inner primary to allow the stator to be removed. I hope Indian addresses this issue on later models.

John White

I ran a Dyna 2000i on my S&S 88 for quite some time. At the time, however, I did not have a laptop computer and could not program it other than the pre-set curves. I have found with the V-Plus from Crazy Horse that fine tuning the ignition curves is a must.

If you do choose to go with the V-Plus from Crazy Horse, call me any time at (858) 449-3069 (my mobile number) and I can help you through all of the ups and downs.

An oil cooler is a must if you switch, we installed a porsche style cooler on my 2000 chief and it works like a champ. As for the fitment, you may need to adjust the upper motor mount (provided with the V-Plus) but everything else bolts right up.

A couple of notes: The stock exhaust from the 1999-2001 should not be used on the V-Plus. The front cylinder head pipe rides against the cam cover and overheats the stock ignition, killing the trigger. The stock exhaust from 2002-2003 is required, or a good aftermarket exhaust like the RB Racing exhaust from RSR racing.

If you have a dry clutch setup, it can be used. I highly recommend moving to a wet primary though, a lot less noise and much more reliable. With the V-Plus you can use several different ignitions. Stock indian or cone style (make your choice when ordering your engine.)

As John said, we have been through 2 motors so far. The first one had issues due to high compression. The current motor is still running strong and, properly tuned, making for one very happy test rider.

Good luck, call me if you have any questions on the V-Plus or if you need any assist with your S&S.

Thank you for the information. My S&S is running good in and of itself, but currently,no pun intended, there seems to be a problem with the ignition system. I bought this bike second hand with 15,500 miles 0n it and now have about 18,500 miles, 3,000 miles give or take in about 4 months. I bought it in South Carolina and rode it home to Illinois last October. It had been sitting awhile so it smelled bad for the first several hours of riding and really didn’t start running half way decent until I hit Tennesse. It was bucking and spitting somewhat under acceleration and didn’t want to run over 65 mph. The engine also died a few times at highway speed and then backfired when it kicked back on. Also the battery would not stay charged, so after jumping it several times I just left it running for about 11 and 1/2 hours straight. The right gas cap would not come off either so I had to refuel every 120 or so miles. What a first ride.

Four batteries, one rectifier, eight or so spark plugs, a starter, and some minor wiring repair later…lol…I’ve about got it whipped!

My next upgrade will probably be a single fire coil and crank trigger and a set of pipes, probably from Hacker as they seem to perform well with these 88″ engines.

If my budget will permit it, I would love to have one of the 100″ engines and a 6 speed transmission. Maybe this winter. Anyway, once again, thank you sir very much.

Sincerely, R.Alan

P.S. All that being said. I wouldn’t give this bike up for anything…It’s an INDIAN and it’s mine.

Yes, the PP100 or as we call it, the V-Plus………..fits in all Gilroy frames including the Scout frames.

To give you some history, we needed someone to test our engine years ago. We provided an engine to a guy named Mike Rock (and many others). Mike rides his 2000 Chief 60 miles to work and 60 miles home each day in L.A. traffic. His S&S blew up so we thought he would be a perfect guy to test our engine. We gave him one on condition that he would report his experiences. When we first purchased the engine program we thought we corrected everything but this engine test program showed that we had issues even beyond what everyone was aware of. Our program required that we inspect the engine at 20K. It was a mess. Mainly the compression ratio. Gilroy had mistakenly thought the compression ratio was 9.5 to 1 but it was actually more than 11-to 1. They did not do their math right. It turned out the combustion chambers were too small (81 to 83 cc) and needed to be enlarged to 90 cc’s to drop the compression to the desired 9.5 to 1. Anyway, our first engines went out with this higher compression ratio and suffered head gasket failures and caused starter failures and we learned that at about 20,000 miles they were used up. This we learned from several test riders buy mostly from Mike Rock because he rides so many miles. So we lowered the compression along with many other problems. Mike Rock loves his engine and continues to report and will comment further on this blog later.

You do not need a remote oil filter. Mike Rock has written a small essay about all the necessary things one must change to get the engine in the bike. The carb is on the left so you need to change these things which is about it. We also provided Rock with a six speed transmission which I highly recommend. We also provided him all the necessary parts to convert to a wet clutch but that was much later in the test program. He is glad to be rid of the dry clutch. We also provided him with a new ignition but at first he used his same ignition that was on his S&S.

You can get one of our engines from us directly. However, you can get them through the Wichita Indian dealer. We also take your broken S&S in on trade and give you a new engine with a two year unlimited mile warranty for a total of $2500 dollars. Mike Rock loves to talk to anyone about his experiences and his conversion. We just had a Lone Wolf meeting in OK and he rode the bike all the way from California and took the record for the longest distance rider at that meeting. I rode his bike while he rode my 09 Indian. I love his bike and that 100 cubic inches makes his bike a real runner. Mike can be reached at 858 882 2156. He is one of many that are riding V-Plus engines in the early Gilroy bikes. In addition, Blackhawk, Jam. Ltd, both specializing in PP100 rebuilding, have provided engines to Gilroy owners. You can find Blackhawk and Jam. Ltd (Malfa) on our web site. They are listed as our distributors. They can provide engines also. Good Luck.

Final note: Indian does plan to sell their 105’s and make them available to Gilroy owners. This engine is fuel injected and does require a larger charging system and ignition system. It will not be cheap. We make a fuel injected V-Plus using the Thunderheart system but our main program is with a carb. It will be nice to see Indian offering this new engine because it seems to be a winner. I have nearly ten thousand miles on my 09. Indian says it will be a couple of years before they can offer the engine. We sell most of our engines to custom bike builders so we welcome and encourage Indian to offer the new 105 engines to Gilroy owners.

Sincerely,

John L. White

Thank you.

I thought you were going to open up a dealership in North Dakota? Rather than take shots at me lets hear how its going with that dealership. Regardless of your attacks I wish you well with that venture. We need a few more dealers.

No, never been in a Denver court and no to your other false claims. I think you have me confused with Richard Block who indeed had many cases in Denver against CMA and IMC. Sorry to say but you are grossly mistaken. My ten thousand dollar offer stands.

The Gilroy Indian Chief and the new KM Indian may have some Harley features but this bike is much different than a Harley. First off, it is eight inches longer than a Road King. The bike is perfect for the big and tall. If you are over six feet tall you do not belong on a Harley. Harley fits a 1950’s size man and that worked then but more and more folks are too tall to fit on that short bike. Yea, you can move things around but the fact is…………….it is too short for tall riders.

The second thing to point out is the suspension. The Indian Chief has a mono shock rear suspension which is superior to that soft tail gadget suspension system with regards to travel.

I do not want to bash Harley. They are a giant compared to Indian. Everywhere you look you see a Harley. Indian riders are thinkers that wish to be different and not follow the crowd. You can say the Indian bike is just a Harley clone but this is not true. It has big……….tall…………and with real features not found on a Harley. Most Harley owners have a fear that Indian will come back and their feelings are justified. Men do not like to look up to other men but if you ride a Harley and you park next to an Indian you can bet you are looking up.

One thing you will notice about Gilroy and KM Chief riders……………they tower over Harley riders in height. If you see a guy on a Harley that is over six feet tall then let him know he should be riding the longer, more comfortable Indian.

I would like to comment about what you said in your post. First, I have several businesses. If Crazy Horse failed today it would not change my life style. With regards to creditability, well you can Google that. Yes, we are about helping Gilroy PowerPlus owners. However, as you may have seen, most of our customers are custom bike builders. I do not view the Gilroy bikes as lemons. The sport the same frame and geometry as the new bikes. Gilroy rushed an engine program and that engine had some major bugs that have taken me over 5 years to fix. Sleeve issues, too much compression, machining errors, you name it. Jerry Correct, the person that designed the engine, suffered through many issues trying to get this engine off the ground in such a short time. Nevertheless, we fixed it.

Most, if not all Gilroy owners love their bikes and do not see them as lemons as you call them. You make a point about the 09’s being ten times better…………well you might be right. When I purchased my 03 the head gaskets blew the first week. On my 09 the engine cases leaked oil through the castings and had to be replaced. The difference was that when my head gaskets failed I returned the bike and Indian was closed. With my 09 the factory shipped the bike back to KM and replaced the castings and that bike now has ten thousand miles on it so you might be right, the 09 is ten times better. In each case the bikes are Indian and I see no reason to have conflict over whether Gilroy was better or KM is better. They are both Indians. What makes them ten times better is the fact that dealers are open and providing service, not to mention the many improvements such as the fuel tank, primary, hydraulic clutch, five more cubes, better charging system, larger rear tire, better forks, better brakes, windshield mounts, key system, and many other items. Yea, you might be right………..the new bikes are ten times better………and they are getting better by the minute. The 2010, which this blog is all about, is another example that Indian lives.

Where did you get the idea that I took Indian to court to prevent them from making bikes? Not true. No matter. We are talking about 09 Indians. I own one. I have my comments without attacking you personally. This blog is not about attacking people personally. I have made some comments about my 09. I stated that I like the motorcycle. I have reported some issues but I have also pointed out that Indian has quickly taken care of them. Folks buying these bikes need to know the problems and also know that Indian is there to fix them. Indian is alive and well. They listen, they want to hear about these issues. They are responding. That is a good sign of a good company.

With regards to issues on motorcycles one can look at the many, many recalls on Harley. Brake failures, transmission issues, wiring, you name it. All manufacturers suffer problems. I look at whether the manufacturer can supply parts and service. Indian can do this and that is what I am reporting. I am considering very seriously about opening Indian Seattle. At this time we are supplying parts and service to Indian dealers. They are offering service to Gilroy owners and we are supporting them with engine rebuilds and complete new engines. Regardless of what you believe, we are supporting Indian with all we got. I will put my money where my mouth is. If you can find any documents where I sued Indian to stop building motorcycles as you claim, I will pay you ten thousand dollars in cash and post the documents. I am asking you please to stop making false claims about me and stop attacking me personally. I will be at Indian KM next week. If you want to sit down and clear this false information I would be happy meet with you.

Sincerely,

John L. White